Human Centered Design in Clinical Research w/ Dr. Noah Goodson

John Reites and Noah Goodson, PhD, explore the concept of human-centered design and its significance in clinical trials. They discuss the principles of human-centered design, how it can be applied in clinical research, and the importance of understanding user experiences to create effective systems. The conversation emphasizes the need for a thoughtful approach to design that prioritizes the needs of patients and stakeholders.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:00

Human-centered design does matter quite a bit. I think probably when people hear it in this industry, your go-to thought is that it's some kind of rebranding of patient centricity. And it's actually not. Human-centered design is actually a design theory, which is an approach to how you design any system or product and how you think about making that really work for people within it.

SPEAKER_01: 0:30

Dr. Mr. Reeds. Hey, it's good to spend time with you. I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_00: 0:35

Happy to be here.

SPEAKER_01: 0:36

I will tell you, it's been a few minutes since the old days where we would record lots of clinical research evolved. I got to tell you, I really miss it, and I wish we were doing it, but this will work. So I really do appreciate you spending a few minutes.

SPEAKER_00: 0:48

Yeah, look, John, we're back here podcasting, but this time we've forced folks to actually see our faces. That's

SPEAKER_01: 0:54

a great point. So I apologize in advance for everybody who doesn't get the audio-only version. Or that we've offended with our faces. So I will. Yeah, thanks for asking, John. Yeah, I mean, I think

SPEAKER_00: 1:44

human-centered design does matter quite a bit. I think probably when people hear it in this industry, your go-to thought is that it's some kind of rebranding of patient-centricity, and it's actually not.

SPEAKER_01: 1:56

Yeah.

UNKNOWN: 1:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:56

Patient centricity isn't patient-centered outcomes research or isn't an approach to how you approach trials. It's not that. Human-centered design is actually a design theory, which is an approach to how you design any system or product and how you think about making that really work for people within it. So it was originally created by the great design theorist Don Norman, who's a very, very famous designer and design thinker. And the easiest way to explain it is just to share four principles that he has, which is, number one, when you're thinking human-centered design in a design You're being, number one, you're being people-centered. Number two, you're taking time to understand and solve the right problem. A lot of times we rush to what we think the problem is. It's this, it's that. You're taking a little bit of extra time to make sure you've really unpacked what the problem is you need to solve. Number three is that everything is a system. And those systems are actually interacting with each other, right? The technology system, with the clinical research system, with the healthcare system, they're all mixing together in this complex way. And finally, what I love about human-centered design is principle number four, which is make small, simple interventions and make them iteratively, right? So you don't go in and you trash everything you've ever learned about clinical trials. You iteratively tweak them towards a way that works better for people.

SPEAKER_01: 3:12

Yeah, it makes complete sense. And then how do you take that and apply it to a clinical trial? Like somebody comes in, I'm a sponsor, I work at a CRO, I'm an agency, I'm trying to design a clinical trial. How do they utilize human-centered design? What's it look like for them?

SPEAKER_00: 3:26

Well, I I mean, you can honestly apply this across so many of the challenges we face in clinical research. And of course you can apply it in building any kind of product, whether that's a digital product or a physical product, but you can also apply it to systems specifically. So a great example would be, I'm thinking of a use case from not that long ago where a client comes in and they've got this really complex neuro trial where you've got to collect some really complicated endpoints. And to collect this endpoint data, this clinician reported outcome, you need some of it collected directly the principal investigator. And you need some of it collected by a separate party called a central raider, which is a raider that's been specifically trained on this one scale of how to deliver it to the participant. And you need both the principal investigator and the central raider and the participant to all be able to connect really close in time, remotely, and be able to reliably collect this very, very specific data so that you can go back to the regulatory agencies and say, hey, our product really is working and we can tell because of XYZ output. Mapping that interact is a great exercise in human-centered design. You map each user's journey, you map how they interact, you denote the tension points, and you have really creative conversations with your team of experts and with the users themselves about how to best resolve and mitigate those tensions. For example, scheduling, a technology connection, et cetera, to make sure that you build the best system for everybody involved. And that's something that we're kind of doing on a really daily basis.

SPEAKER_01: 4:53

So if I'm that same user, like I'm at a biopharma. I'm at a serum agency. How do I apply this today? How do I get started? What do I do?

SPEAKER_00: 5:02

Well, I think, I think if you want to get started today, I think one of the easiest things you can possibly do is be empathetic. And that means understanding and thinking about the experience of another user. So when I just drop this new thing on a research site, or I just say, well, the participant needs to do these, all these assessments and a visit thinking about what that means. Hey, this mother with her sick kid is is coming into the doctor's office for eight hours to do all of these things. That's a lot with a non-sick kid. That's right. What's it going to be like with this? Is there any way I can split this up? Is there any way I can alleviate that burden while still protecting my data? I've got to collect the data. Otherwise, there's no point in running the study. But is there a way we can make this a better experience that maybe is easier for everyone involved and still meets my end goals?

SPEAKER_01: 5:49

Yeah, that makes sense. And then is that when you sort of dig into that further, this journey map, is it literally like a map with swim lanes and process steps? Is that what someone should go build or is there a different kind of output that would matter more to them?

SPEAKER_00: 6:03

I mean, the real output is the decisions. All the tools, all the human-centered design pieces are just tools. Yeah, you can definitely do process maps of all kinds of standardized ways to do that that are extremely well denoted in different places. You can learn how to do this. Those are tools. The tools should lead you to the output. And the output, if you remember your core principles, right, is that we're being people-centered and we're making small, simple interventions. And when we're, we're doing really those two things together, following those principles, if we're solving the right problem and we've understood how it interacts with other systems, I think you're going to be really successful in making better decisions, whether you're designing a trial or whether you're applying it or whether you're fixing a problem in an ongoing study.

SPEAKER_01: 6:42

It makes total sense. Noah, I really appreciate you spending a few minutes to walk through this for people. Again, if they want to learn more about human centered design, they obviously can Google it. There's a lot of YouTube, there's some great resources out there, but if someone has this really specific question they want to know about? How do they get a hold of you?

SPEAKER_00: 6:58

Yeah, you can find just find me on LinkedIn, Noah Goodson on LinkedIn, I'd be happy to connect. I love talking about this stuff. And there's a lot more depth and detail. Practically, it's not just build a journey map vaguely vaguely, you really need to you really need to be kind of specific in how you approach these processes. Otherwise, you're just adding a sort of steps that aren't going to be that lead you down the path of success. So it does matter how you do it.

SPEAKER_01: 7:20

Makes total sense. Noah, thanks a lot. Good to see you. And we'll talk again soon.

SPEAKER_00: 7:24

Yeah, absolutely.

UNKNOWN: 7:26

Thank you.